RE: Quality of coating and corrosion protection

R1200RS + R1250RS Forum � 1200 RS technology � General topics � Quality of coating and corrosion protection

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#31 | RE: Quality of coating and corrosion protection datum

Sun Jan 27, 2019 7:21 pm

Having owned Japanese sport bikes since 1984 I always secretly lusted after the BMW. The one thing that kept my from buying one sooner than I did was the used ones I would see on the road mostly had some sort of corrosion showing. Bolt heads, aluminum castings etc. Always bothered me about the product, especially for the price compared to my Japanese bikes which always looked new after you cleaned off the road grime. Very disappointed in BMW's approach and all the effort and time spent fighting with BMW about the issues. Maybe time change brands before mine starts having issues.

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#32 | RE: Quality of coating and corrosion protection datum

Mon Jan 28, 2019 12:30 am

My daughter's 1981 R65LS has seen a fairly rough life, including years of riding in Seattle almost every day. There is very little corrosion on that bike and the original tool kit looks like new, too. It is just a matter of specifying quality parts. Probably has something to do with counting beans.

Current motorcycle collection: 2002 Yamaha FZ1; 2005 Triumph Bonneville T-100; 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500; 2009 BMW F650GS; 2016 BMW R1200RS; 2018 Zero S 16.6 kWh

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#33 | RE: Quality of coating and corrosion protection datum

Mon Jan 28, 2019 12:56 am

I have had loads of bikes over the years. Everything from an Aerial Arrow in 1971 to my RS and I can honestly say I have never seen paint on a centre stand like my RS. The stand has more rust than paint. When I last had it serviced I mentioned it, they took pictures and I�ve never heard anything more from them. I did say that if and when I came back to swop it, don�t tell me it�s now worth as much because of the stand!
I do not like to complain it is not in my nature. I just vote with my feet and spend my money elsewhere. Love the bike.

these members like the post: albrown and Dave H

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#34 | RE: Quality of coating and corrosion protection datum

Mon Jan 28, 2019 2:29 am

Zitat von Basil R im Beitrag #33
I have had loads of bikes over the years. Everything from an Aerial Arrow in 1971 to my RS and I can honestly say I have never seen paint on a centre stand like my RS. The stand has more rust than paint. When I last had it serviced I mentioned it, they took pictures and I�ve never heard anything more from them. I did say that if and when I came back to swop it, don�t tell me it�s now worth as much because of the stand!
I do not like to complain it is not in my nature. I just vote with my feet and spend my money elsewhere. Love the bike.

Once a year I sand the rust off of my RS center stand and repaint it with rattle-can black. Interestingly, my too-long side stand looks like new after three and a half years. No rust and no special care.

Current motorcycle collection: 2002 Yamaha FZ1; 2005 Triumph Bonneville T-100; 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500; 2009 BMW F650GS; 2016 BMW R1200RS; 2018 Zero S 16.6 kWh

Dave H likes the post

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#35 | RE: Quality of coating and corrosion protection datum

Wed Jan 30, 2019 12:13 pm

Zitat von Ray im Beitrag #29
Zitat von Fugly im Beitrag #26
After about 3500 miles 95% of which have been dry miles and none on salted roads my centre stand has orange specs on it.

The paint quality on the chassis components is abysmal. Will be talking to Wollastons come spring time

I have the same problem on the centre stand at just over 3000 miles. I bought the bike from BMW Cotswold last year with 2000 miles on the clock. It was their demonstrator. The corrosion was evident even at that time but I was lazy and didn't pursue it with them until the beginning of December. The bike is just outside warranty and my approach to BMW for goodwill, etc, via the dealer failed. The reply from BMW Technical was "there�s no manufacturing defect with the corrosion" and my further approach to BMW Customer Services resulted in "The warranty that comes with your Bike covers the costs of any manufacturing or mechanical faults that occur during this time. It doesn�t cover the cost of issues caused by external influences or wear and tear. As well as this, if it�s felt there�s no manufacturing fault present, we would feel it�s reasonable for the customer to cover the costs of maintaining their own car ( my insertion - yes that's right, they said car). Looking on our systems, I can see that technical have advised there�s no manufacturing defect with the corrosion. With this in mind, I�m afraid we wouldn�t look to provide a contribution to your repair costs."

Given my own experience and the examples I have read about on this forum I believe there is a quality problem during the manufacturing process of painted parts and have responded to Customer Services accordingly. I'm not holding my breath.

This is supposed to be a Premium Product. I'll keep you posted.

I got this reply from Customer Services yesterday.
"While I do appreciate your frustrations with this, it has reached the highest point of escalation when it comes to technical advice. The overall findings is that there�s no manufacturing defect with the bike and as mentioned previously, we do feel it�s reasonable for the customer to maintain their own product when there�s no longer a warranty present.

I�m afraid that there�s nothing further we�re able to assist with at this time as there�s no manufacturing defect."

Clearly BMW set a very low quality standard if there conclusion is "there's no manufacturing defect". As for "we do feel it�s reasonable for the customer to maintain their own product". Cheeky f***ers.

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#36 | RE: Quality of coating and corrosion protection datum

Wed Jan 30, 2019 4:02 pm

My thought is that there is a paint quality and application problem that needs to be addressed. And my experience from buying 8 BMW motorcycle over the past 34 years is that they might very well improve the corrosion protection of the centerstand on future models, but will never admit that there really was a problem that they needed to fix. Keep your eye out for a new part number on future replacement center stands.

Does anyone here recall the failing center stand issue that some BMW models had during the late 1980's or early 1990's? I think it might have involved weak center stands on the K-bikes. I recall one time at my BMW dealer hearing a crash and then a row of parked bikes falling over like dominoes. The BMW's center stand at the end of the row suddenly just broke with no one around it while parked, toppling against the adjacent bike and on down the line. That was not the only report of that happening to customers bikes of that era. Now that issue certainly got BMW's attention, was rapidly fixed, and something quite like that has never happened again to my knowledge.

And then there was the issue of soft aluminum wheel rims that kept bending when "authority" models would hit pot holes on the freeway sometime around the turn of the century. The typical BMW customer had been complaining about that "feature" for a few years prior and had been told by their dealers to just increase tire air pressure in the tires and that would protect the rims. But when "authority" figures started complaining about soft rims, BMW didn't waste any time developing harder wheel rims, which pretty much brought the problem under control.

And so it goes with BMW.

Current motorcycle collection: 2002 Yamaha FZ1; 2005 Triumph Bonneville T-100; 2011 Royal Enfield Bullet 500; 2009 BMW F650GS; 2016 BMW R1200RS; 2018 Zero S 16.6 kWh

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#37 | RE: Quality of coating and corrosion protection datum

Thu Jan 31, 2019 3:59 pm

Zitat von Richard230 im Beitrag #36
Does anyone here recall the failing center stand issue that some BMW models had during the late 1980's or early 1990's? I think it might have involved weak center stands on the K-bikes.

The centerstand broke on my '85 K100RS within a year or so of new. I was on a trip and was putting it on the stand for overnight and pitched it onto the right side. It broke where the side arm attaached to the down leg. The dealer offered to do all repairs and replace the stand or reinforce and weld up the original. I chose to reinforce and re-weld as I couldn't say a replacement would last either. That stand was on the bike until it just wore out. This was the curved leg style. I replace it later with a straight leg K11 model.

Also the "Y" spoked wheels were so soft that I took a dead blow mallet to them at each tire change (I was doing that myself back then). This post dredges up some not-so-fond memories.

Frank

2017 R1200RS- 18,000 mi. 18 mo.
2003 R1100S Boxer Cup Replika #6/200
1985 K100/1100RS- 326,000 mi. 33 yrs.
2016 R1200RS- 28,322 mi. 18 mo. (gone)
2011 R1200RT- 30,000 mi. 2 yr. (gone)
2005 R1200ST- 58,000 mi. 8 yr. 3rd deer killed it.
1999 R1100S- 15,000 mi. 2 yr. (gone)
1996 Ducati 900SS/SP- 89,000 mi. 12 yr. (gone)

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#38 | RE: Quality of coating and corrosion protection datum

Thu Jan 31, 2019 5:10 pm (Last edited: Thu Jan 31, 2019 5:12 pm)

I had the centre stand, side stand, throttle bodies, grab rails, rear sub frame, drive shaft case and front engine casing all replaced under warranty, as well as a new steering damper and headers which the dealer picked up at an end of warranty inspection. The main frame paint (red) was perfect so it was clear to me that something was up with the components finished in black. UKer

Bill

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#39 | RE: Quality of coating and corrosion protection datum

Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:21 pm (Last edited: Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:22 pm)

Zitat von Bunter im Beitrag #38
I had the centre stand, side stand, throttle bodies, grab rails, rear sub frame, drive shaft case and front engine casing all replaced under warranty, as well as a new steering damper and headers which the dealer picked up at an end of warranty inspection. The main frame paint (red) was perfect so it was clear to me that something was up with the components finished in black. UKer

Bill

Wow - that�s a shocker, so many poorly finished parts!
As for the centre stands of the 1980�s, my 1981 boxer needs it centre stand �building up� with weld metal every few years, otherwise it sits on both wheels and is an absolute bugger to lift off the stand. I�ve seen some comments that our 1200RS is difficult to put on and take off the main stand - you have no idea how bad it can be on the old airheads!!

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#40 | RE: Quality of coating and corrosion protection datum

Fri Feb 01, 2019 12:57 pm

I can't speak to corrosion on the centerstand, as my '16 RS seems to be holding up well. But, my brother has a 1st gen Kawasaki Concours. I typically take care of his general service needs (oil, brake, fork fluids, tire changes, etc). I would argue it's position as the most difficult bike to hoist up on it's centerstand. If it is full of fuel in it's (seemingly) 17 gallon tank, it's very nearly a 2 person job. It should be part of the Olympics - The Connie Clean and Jerk